Flipping The Script: Our Voices

Episode title and number:
Flipping The Script: Our Voices 5-#3

Summary of the show:
At Bold Blind Beauty On A.I.R., we believe sensitive yet necessary questions around blindness are crucial to break barriers, address stigma, and eradicate stereotypes, recognizing that each blind person is as unique as anyone else. In this episode, Gabby Mendonca and Jonathan Rubinov guest host Bold Blind Beauty On A.I.R., sharing personal blindness experiences with interviewer Andrea Andy Chadwick. In advocating for A.I.R. (Access, Inclusion, and Representation™), they discuss daily life, challenges, technology, support, and the need for greater understanding from sighted individuals.

Supporting Our Advocacy Work:
⦁ Be a part of the change! Support our advocacy efforts. 

Bullet points of key topics & timestamps:
00:00 | Introduction and Hosts Introduction
00:35 | Meet the Guest Hosts: Gabby and Jonathan
01:12 | Introducing the Interviewer: Andrea (Andy) Chadwick
02:13 | Unveiling Personal Stories
06:05 | Challenges and Misconceptions
10:42 | Technological Innovations and Accessibility
14:23 | Organizational Tools and Independence
24:10 | Social Life and Networking
28:24 | Closing Remarks and Contact Information

Jonathan's Socials: 

• Facebook: @JonathanRubinov
• Instagram: @jonathan.rubinov
• LinkedIn: @jonathan-rubinov

Gabby's Socials: 

• Instagram: @g.donza_
• TikTok: @g.donza

Bold Blind Beauty On A.I.R. features thoughtful conversations that challenge assumptions, broaden perspectives, and celebrate the richness of disability experiences, rooted in A.I.R. (Access, Inclusion, & Representation)™.

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May Bold Blind Beauty always be known not for the noise it made,
but for the understanding it cultivated.

Music Credit: "Ambient Uplifting Harmonic Happy" By Panda-x-music  https://audiojungle.net/item/ambient-uplifting-harmonic-happy/46309958

Thanks for listening!❤️

Transcript

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Introduction and Hosts Introduction

Steph: Welcome back to another edition of Bold Blind Beauty On A.I.R., the show that's clearing the air for more A.I.R. (Access, Inclusion, and Representation)™. My name is Stephanae McCoy, and with me are my co-hosts. 

Dana: I'm Dana Hinnant, 

Nasreen: I'm Nasreen Bhutta, 

Sylvia: and this is Sylvia Stinson Perez. 

Gabby: Welcome back, Bold Blind Beauty Fam. 

Meet the Guest Hosts: Gabby and Jonathan

Gabby: I'm your guest-host Gabby Mendonca, stepping in for the amazing regular crew today. 

Jonathan: Hey everyone, my name is Jonathan Rubinov, a Bold Blind Beauty intern cohosting here with Gabby.

Gabby: Yes, and today, Jonathan, we're actually doing something a little bit different. We are turning the tables. Jonathan and I are in the hot seats. 

Jonathan: That's right, Gabby. We are planning to discuss our unique experiences as individuals navigating the world on the blindness spectrum. 

Gabby: And guiding us through this interview is a wonderful friend of Bold Blind Beauty and a true ally to our community.

Jonathan: Our interviewer is a British-born voiceover artist with a broadcast-quality home studio. As a dedicated, Bold Blind Beauty supporter and a huge advocate for the blind community, she has lent her incredible vocal talent to commercials, narration, audiobooks, and corporate projects. Known for her quick turnaround, transparent rates, and collaborative spirit.

Introducing the Interviewer: Andrea (Andy) Chadwick 

Gabby: So, please welcome the fantastic Andrea (Andy) Chadwick. 

Andy: Oh, that's so special. Hello, Gabby and Jonathan. Oh, that's so wonderful. It warms my heart. It's such a pleasure to be here and to have this opportunity to learn more from you both. I'm ready to dive in and ask some of those specific questions.

Are you ready yes, to dive in?. 

Jonathan: Yep, we are. 

Andy: Awesome, let's go. 

Unveiling Personal Stories

Andy: So this question is for both of you all right? So, Gabby, if you wanna start with the answer. Okay. Can you tell me a bit about yourselves? Were you born blind? Or did you lose your sight? Gabby? 

Gabby: Sure. So I was not born blind. I lost my vision relatively young. I was still a baby. And you know, it happened kind of in a very interesting way. I had a tumor on my optic nerve, and that's what caused my vision loss. It took some time to adjust to that growing up, but I'm, in many ways, grateful that I was able to find the support and the connections that I needed in order to help me to kind of move through that and understand that I could live a life with visual impairment.

Andy: Oh, bless. How about you, Jonathan? 

Jonathan: I'm a different story. So I was born with congenital glaucoma. I was diagnosed with this disease when I was eight months old, and I still have it till this day. So basically my vision started worsening when I was 13 years old, uh, since I had high eye pressure and my optic nerve began to quickly degenerate. As a result, I was losing a lot of vision. Eventually, I had a retinal detachment in my right eye. So, currently I still have one eye left. So I can only see very little from my left eye to the point where my vision is classified as hand motion.

I had significantly greater vision during my childhood. I could still read 12-point fonts, have respectable distance vision, and perform different activities. I could play video games. I could do projects independently. I could do computer work without using screen readers. Now it's a completely different story, and I had to adapt to my vision loss by using different technologies and resources that are available to me.

Andy: Oh, thank you for that, Jonathan. Thanks for letting us know. And actually, you answered another question of mine, and so Gabby, I would like to ask you this. How much sight do you have? What can you see and what can you not see? 

Gabby: I have no sight. I have zero light perception, zero shadow perception. So oftentimes, people who are blind or visually impaired will have either one of those options. Sometimes it varies; blindness is a spectrum, but for me, I have none of those. So I can't see light, can't see shadows, can't see faces, can't see colors, none of it. And, you know, my vision, my eye condition, isn't something that's progressive, or something that can kind of like come up again. It's one of those things where once I lose it, that's kind of it, you know? And so, yeah, that would be my answer to that question. 

Andy: Oh, thank you for being so open. Let me just add here because I know some of the questions might be sensitive, and to the listeners, too. So I just wanna state this is a safe space. The questions are asked in love and understanding. And, if there is anything that you don't want to answer, you know, feel free, or if you want to, correct me on something, feel free. Okay? So, this platform right now is for everybody to understand and learn.

All right? So I'm going to make a funny. It could be funny, it might not be funny, and either one of you can answer this. 

Challenges and Misconceptions

Andy: What is the one question you receive that absolutely annoys you? Jonathan, you wanna go ahead? 

Jonathan: Sure. So that question I often receive, which often annoys me, is How can you walk by yourself? There's one incident that occurred recently. I just said, Hey, I'm gonna just walk to the store, gimme five minutes, it's right here, I'll be right back. He was one of my guests in my family that never met me before, formally. So he was confused, like, how can you go? You can't see. How can you go to the store? He was like completely bewildered about how I was about to leave the house by myself.

So I told him, first of all, I use a white cane that I sweep on the ground. So that allows me to feel obstacles along the way, and it acts as a symbol to notify the pedestrians around me that I'm visually impaired, so they can kind of like turn around and avoid me coming and bumping into them. I also use navigation, I use Google Maps, which gives me walking directions to my local grocery store. 

I also complete street crossings independently, through listening to the environment around me. Looking for a parallel search, making sure there are no cars around, and safely crossing intersections without needing the assistance of someone. If I do need assistance, I can just kindly ask someone around me, Hey, can you please help me cross the street? And 99% of the time, they'll be willing to do so, and I have no problems with that. So that's basically what I explained to him. That's how I go to local destinations without needing the support of people, except when I wanna ask someone to help me cross the street. 

Andy: That's awesome, Jonathan. Thanks for letting us know. See people, listen, listen up. All right. Gabby, how about you,  darling? 

Gabby: I mean, very similar to Jonathan. I've definitely gotten that same question, but I think the biggest one for me has always just been like, how do you do anything independently? How do you figure out how to find a car if you're booking a Lyft or an Uber, or a paratransit? How do you know how to cross the street? A lot of questions that kind of tie into your independence as a blind person. 

And just for everybody that's listening that hasn't had the experience or interaction with a blind person before, every single blind person does that differently. You know, Jonathan might say, okay, let me pull up these apps, and this is what's gonna help him. Whereas, like, apps can also help me, too, but I think it just depends on the situation sometimes. I think just a lot of questions that like really feel like they are tapping into someone questioning your independence as a person because they see your disability first, they don't see you as a person. And so I think just all of it kind of bothers me. I would say. 

Jonathan: That's true. 

Andy: Yeah. And this is why we need to have these conversations, right? Mm-hmm. So that, you know, people understand. And I think that's one of my questions, that I had. I'll ask this right now because we're talking about this, but what's one thing you wish more sighted people understood about being blind or visually impaired? 

Gabby: Just understand that not every blind person you meet is the same as the last blind person you met, or going to be the same as the next blind person you meet. Also, know that the tools we use are different. How we approach life is different. How we navigate the world is different. And also understand that, you know, when you make assumptions about us, you kind of place us into this one box, and so be more open to educating yourself and asking the questions that are appropriate and respectful. Oftentimes, you'll find that we will answer your questions as long as you're approaching us with respect and you're not doing it in a way that is inappropriate.

And I would just say, just have more of an open mind and know that there are other communities outside of the ones that you might possibly know of. 

Andy: Absolutely. I love that. Good for you. How about you, Jonathan? How would you answer that? 

Jonathan: Yeah, 100% everything Gabby says is applicable to my answer as well. 

Technological Innovations and Accessibility

Jonathan: And I just wanted to say, like, I'm just so like surprised by how many incredible innovations and technologies that have been released recently that is helping blind people with accessibility. And just having access to things that we never could have dreamed of before, for example, the Ray Ban Meta glasses allow me to read a book that's inaccessible to me. A standard print book in which I can't see the font, I put on these glasses, and it reads me the whole book without a problem. We didn't have this technology five years ago. If you told me we did, I would not have believed you. I tried these glasses in person for myself, like, like, around a week ago, and they blew my mind. 

Andy: Oh, that's awesome. 

Jonathan: This is like revolutionary technology. Like, not having access to print was one of the biggest barriers for the visually impaired community for decades, right? And now we actually have a solution that allows us to literally read books in a library like sighted people. Yeah. And just read, we can read without asking a volunteer. We can do it like everyone else, and it's incredible. And I want people to know that blind people are more functional and capable than the average person thinks.

Andy: Yes. 

Jonathan: And a lot of us have very respectable occupations and levels of education, and we could definitely make a monumental impact in society, in ways that all sighted people can. Through hard work, through perseverance, through collaboration, through striving for, you know, perfection, whether that's alone or with other people.

And, we are just lucky, living in the 21st century in the most advanced society that we have ever known. And we're benefiting and learning about new innovations every single day that are making our lives easier and productive at the same time. 

Andy: Oh, I love that, Jonathan. See, see, technology is wonderful, right?

Mm-hmm. I know the big topics are AI and the bad, but there is such good as well. Yes. And some things that are underway that are gonna help all of the communities. So, Jonathan, thank you for saying that. This is the conversation that we need to have, and we need to share so people know and know what's out there. Now you were talking about college and school and everything, so I have a question about that.

Dana's Beauty Byte 

Dana: Multipurpose beauty products can save you time, space, and money. Here's some ideas that you might want to try. 

Aloe vera gel in its purest form can help soothe a sunburn, that random pimple that pops up, or hair gel for your styling needs. 

Tinted moisturizers or BB creams can act as your foundation, your SPF if it's in the product, or serve as a base primer for powder foundation if it has luminosity to it.

Cheek tints can do your lips, cheeks, and eyes for a natural glow. 

Shea butter or mango butter can serve as a body moisturizer or hair treatment. Please do a patch test on the skin for any allergic reactions.

And that's your Bold Blind Beauty Byte.

Organizational Tools and Independence

Andy: So, how do you guys stay organized and manage your schedule, especially when you have classes, assignments, and job tasks? What's your day-to-day look like, Jonathan? 

Jonathan: So for college, I completely rely on two devices. I use my iPhone and iPad, which helps me with everything I need to do in terms of, calling a family member to drive me to school. For me to complete my assignments and submit them on time. For me to access my eBooks, my emails, my documents, and everything I need. A lot of people use laptops and desktops. I prefer the simplicity of the iPad. 

Gabby: Yes. 

Jonathan: That allows me to do everything. It has literally everything I need for school and personal use. And this is something I've been using for over nine years now and has never failed me. And it's made me, I would say, an organized and just productive student who can keep up with the rest of my sighted peers.

Andy: You go, Jonathan, you go, how about you, Gabby? 

Gabby: Yeah, I'm 100% with Jonathan on that. I mean, even when I was in school, I used my iPad. I have a computer, but I've been using my iPad since I was like 15 or 14. And so it's always been such a useful piece of equipment for me. I have everything in a folder on my iPad. So for productivity, I can find all my apps in there, for writing, you know, I can find all the apps I need for that in there. And then on top of that, I do use a braille [00:16:00] display. So, for instance, I use the Mantis Q 40. That can actually connect to my iPad or my phone, or my computer if I wanted to use it, without having to be next to the device. But the iPad, like Jonathan has said, it never, whether it's for my own use, podcasting, or contributing to BBB, like whatever it is, it's been so useful. Also for when I was in school, it was like really helpful just to use it that way 'cause I could email professors my assignments quickly, and just get things done in a more proficient professional way. So yeah. 

Andy: You are very awesome. All of you. So while we're on this, here's a question. What's one thing that helps you feel confident and independent in your daily routine? Okay. Gabby, go ahead. 

Gabby: I think a few things. I would say the first thing is just things that are more organized and laid out, mm-hmm. When things are not laid out or organized or, you know, set up in a specific way, sometimes it kind of makes me feel like I don't have control over what's happening. Mm-hmm. And it can be a little bit more hectic, especially from not being able to visually look around and look at things. I think just not being afraid to ask people for help. Sometimes that's a big thing for people; asking for help can be hard. But honestly, just learning when to ask for help is big, but in terms of my confidence and independence, just really trusting that the skills that I've gained are what's helping me. Whether it's leaving the house by myself or it's working on something at home, meeting a deadline, whatever the case may be. Really trusting that what I've learned is what's guiding me internally.

And yeah, I would say just believing in me and trusting that if I do need the help, then I will ask for it, and if not, then I'll just figure it out until I can't do it anymore. 

Andy: Oh, bless you. Yes, asking for help is something I think that everybody has to deal with, right? Mm-hmm. There are always questions, so that's awesome to know. How about you, Jonathan? Do you have anything to add to that? 

Jonathan: Yeah, I completely agree with Gabby. I would like to say that my family helps me do everything. They always care for me. They provide me with everything I need.

Gabby: Yeah. 

Jonathan: I can always ask them for help if there's something inaccessible, I need them just to quickly read, or just for them to drive me to school and pick me up, and go back home. For them to help me navigate inaccessible websites that don't work with VoiceOver or JAWS, they're always there for me. And I think also, just making friends is also very important for you to feel confident in yourself. Socializing is the absolute key to living a life where you feel satisfied and where you have stable mental health. 

Gabby: Yes. 

Jonathan: And I think also my professors are very understanding. They're very accommodating. I always feel comfortable, and I'm always willing to ask them questions about my coursework. Like, how's my status in the class? If I need an extension on an assignment, they're always there for me, and they understand my situation. So I'm very grateful for that, especially that my college has a great office of special services for students with disabilities that accommodates us in different ways, to make the school curriculum accessible to us despite our being visually impaired. And I think there are two key factors. I think it's the way you support yourself, and I think it's the way other people support you, that is the ultimate factor in you living the best life possible, basically.

Andy: Bravo. Mm-hmm. What's the name of your school, Jonathan? 

Jonathan: It's Queens College in New York. 

Andy: Yes. Give him a clap. That's awesome. That is awesome. 

Gabby: Yeah. 

Jonathan: Thank you. 

Andy: And I'm glad you said you talked about your professors because that was gonna be a question on what you wish professors and coworkers, and any of your employers, even your family and your friends that are around you. What do you want them to know or wish that they knew about working with the blind or visually impaired people? So I think you touched a lot on that, Jonathan. Did you have anything, Gabby, that you wanted to add in regards to whoever's around you? Even with your family? Mm-hmm. Sometimes, people are scared to ask questions. 

Gabby: I did wanna add to that about the professors, especially. My college experience was not a great college experience. I left there with really great friends, but overall, the educational part of it was really tough, especially with accessibility and accommodations. So I think focusing on professors know that if a student is coming to you for help, trust that, yes, we get it, you have so many students that you're trying to guide and help. But if a student with a disability is coming to you because they have gotten to the point where they don't feel that they're being properly accommodated, please pay attention to that. Because when you don't, they feel like they've fallen even further behind in class. 

Take me for example, I had to send out an accommodation letter, what felt like way too frequently, and yeah, every now and then during the semester, you might send it out. But for me, it felt like it was almost every other week I had to resend it because I was discriminated against in my school experience with professors. So, I think the training that happens, how professors learn how to help people with visual impairments or other disabilities, is really big. But just pay attention and know that if we're coming to you for help, it's because we genuinely need it. And don't pity us. Don't put us in a box and say, Oh, well this student with the accommodation letter keeps coming to me because at the end of the day, we're still people, we're still a student. We're still here to learn an education just like everybody else is, except for the fact that we have the added bonus of visual impairment.

And the same can be said in other areas of life, for family, for friends, who allow us to come to them when we need help. Jonathan, I agree with what you said with like my family has always been very supportive and very helpful. And I'm grateful that I can go to them for things, but just knowing that hey, I can figure it out, and if I can't figure it out, I promise I will come to you. But don't pity or try to do whatever it is that we could do for ourselves unless we really do need the help. And know that we are very independent a lot of the time. And, again, I'll keep repeating it, blindness is a spectrum and not every single one of us is going to look the same, act the same, do the same things, and interact with you in the same ways. 

Andy: That's absolute. Thank you for all of that. It's like taking your independence away. 

Gabby: Mm-hmm.

Andy: When somebody's not listening. So I appreciate that and thank you for being transparent. I'm so sorry that you went through that experience too. Jonathan, I'm glad that you're able to shed a brighter light on your experience. So, thank you for the experiences, and I appreciate that.

I'm going to ask you something, and forgive me. 

Social Life and Networking

Andy: So, when it comes to your social life, how do you navigate your dating experiences, friendships, and networking? Jonathan, you touched on that, about networking and getting out there, how do you navigate your ups and downs? Are there any challenges? So, what is your experience like? What do you guys do? And talk about your friends too. 

Jonathan: Sure, I can start if that's okay. 

Andy: Yeah, go ahead. 

Jonathan: So personally, I have not dated yet, so I can't touch up on that. But, socially, I do want to say that I go to this blind hockey activity. So it's basically an adaptive sport for blind, visually impaired players who are interested in playing hockey. You play with only visually impaired players, and there are certain volunteers and coaches who help orchestrate the team and run everything.

It's been an incredible experience in which I get to play the sport. It's not even like a bend-down version. It's the real, it's professional hockey, but with blind people. And I go on a weekly basis. Thank you. And I met so many great people there. Like, one of my friends is on my team. I met so many coaches that I like to talk to. It's been a captivating experience, in which I just have so much fun and I get to socialize and network as well because I did meet a lot of nice people that also helped me a lot with a lot of stuff happening outside of hockey, so it's been amazing.

Andy: That's brilliant. How about you, Gabby? 

Gabby: So I think for me, I'm at the point in life where I am trying to start dating, and it's been really tough. It’s not been fun to be honest because we live in a society where everything is online dating, right? Like that's the biggest thing now. Yep. Oh, if you can't meet people in person, like just go download a few apps and figure it out. Yeah, that's okay every now and then I've tried that, but it's not my thing. 

Personally speaking, I've just, and even before, I just always known that I would prefer to meet people in person. Because when you're talking to someone, let's say, and hopefully, Jonathan, this never happens to you. I think guys sometimes maybe have a little bit of different luck than blind women do, hopefully. But oftentimes, you can be talking to someone and everything's fine. You're like, oh, cool, I'm making a cool connection with someone. And then you drop the, oh, by the way, you should know I'm blind, and they just fall off the face of the earth like you don't exist anymore. So everything you've said up until that point is like, oh, I looked at you as this abled-bodied person, but now that I find out that you're blind. I'm gonna have to obviously take care of you because clearly you can't do anything for yourself. It's a whole extra barrier, which is why I prefer meeting people in person, and that's been tough in itself, but it is what it is. 

Socializing has been a lot better for me. I have really great friends from school and from years ago, whom I spend a lot of time with. We like to do karaoke, which is a big thing for us. Yeah, I know, you like karaoke too, Andy. So we do karaoke. We go out to eat. We always like to try something different, and I think that's kind of opened my mind to more potential things that are out there instead of just kind of like. You know, a few things, which is, which are cool. Like you find what you feel comfortable with and you kind of go with the flow with that, and you make friendships and connections off of that, and through those people too. So yeah, socializing is cool, and I've found that to be a little bit easier.  

Andy: I thank you so much, both of you, for this. You know how I feel about you, my heart, so I appreciate you and allowing me to do this. 

Closing Remarks and Contact Information 

Just before you guys end it, if anybody wants to reach out to you, how can they get in contact with you? Or follow you on social, Jonathan? 

Jonathan: Yeah. I'll definitely link my Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn. Feel free to DM me or message me on any of those platforms. But yeah, please contact me. If you have any questions or just wanna have a chat about any topics we mentioned? I'm more than welcome to communicate with anyone about this.

Andy: How about you, Gabby? 

Gabby: Yeah, you could find me on Instagram or TikTok. Instagram at g.donza_. You can DM me there, ask me anything. I'm more than happy to answer those questions or even make a potential video about it. Who knows? 

Andy: Because you are awesome on social media. Yes, you are.

Gabby: Thank you, Andy. 

Andy: Oh, you are very welcome. So I'm going to hand it all back to you, Gabby. 

Gabby: Of course. Well, that's all the A.I.R. we have for you today. Jonathan, it was great getting to co-host with you.

Jonathan: Absolutely. Thank you, Gabby. And a huge thanks to Andy as well for turning the mic on us. It's been a pleasure. 

Gabby: Yes. We hope that you all enjoyed hearing such a different perspective on Bold Blind Beauty On A.I.R. And remember, our conversation doesn't end here, make sure you subscribe so that you don't miss out on future episodes with the regular hosts and more incredible guests.

Jonathan: And to access behind-the-scenes footage, personal stories, and daily doses of empowerment, be sure to join the Bold Blind community on Instagram. 

Gabby: Your support truly means the world as we continue to amplify diverse voices and share powerful stories. Let's keep advocating together for Access, Inclusion, and Representation™.

Jonathan: Until later, folks, keep it bold and beautiful.